1:8 Epic Social Media Strategy

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Lee:

Hi, and welcome to the WP Innovator podcast, the WordPress podcast for design and web agencies. Let's make WordPress work for your business. Hi, and welcome to the WP Innovator podcast. This is Lee and today we are going to be talking with Sarah Moore, social media specialist and rising star of Periscope. Sarah, she's full of brilliant advice, so be sure to make notes. But I will say if you're driving, just make sure that they are mental notes. That would be much safer. Before we get started, this podcast is sponsored by Soci Press. Soci Press is the world's first set, and forget Twitter automation tool for WordPress. It'll share and re share your valuable content as well as allow you to create strategic content plans that can be scheduled automatically. So go ahead, check it out and grab the amazing launch price on leejackdondev.com/plugin. That's leejacksondev.com/plugin. Right then, without further ado, let's crack on with the show. Hi, this is Lee, and I'm with somebody who is an absolute inspiration to me, and I don't think she believes me when I say that, but her name is Sarah Moore. Sarah is a social media specialist, strategist, periscopist, and many ists all related to social media ists as is a RISMs.

Lee:

She's pretty much awesome. So hey, Sarah, do you want to say hi?

Sarah Moore:

Hi. Thanks for having me.

Lee:

Pleasure. So you may be able to tell that Sarah is from Australia. She's just been complaining about how cold it is down there this time of winter. So we really feel for you. What temperature is it right now?

Sarah Moore:

So our summer temperature is... I don't know. What is it? It's like, I don't know, the sun's out. That's all I need to know. I've got the air conditioning on.

Lee:

Air conditioning. That's all you need to know. That's all we need to know. And here in England, we essentially don't have air conditioning. We have one hot day a year, and we're all like, Oh, I really need to buy air conditioning for that one hot day. And we all resolve to buy it. And then after that one hot day and it's freezing cold again, we're just like, Yeah, meh, no. And we'll just make do with a fan and a bucket of ice behind the fan. That's pretty much air conditioning in the UK. But I think our hot weather is a cold day for you guys anyway.

Sarah Moore:

Yeah, probably. And then you guys all just come to Australia to live anyway.

Lee:

Exactly. Let's be fair. Although if you're going to say that, most people when they move to Canada, they stay, whereas statistically, when they move to Australia, I think something like so many percentage come back. I don't know why that is. I think it's probably too hot. I think we can't cope. We've not got the temperature for it. But anyway, so as you can tell, Sarah is really cool to chat to. She actually does our social media here at Lee Jackson Dev, and she gives me loads of amazing advice in regards to strategy. She is actually the main person that got my arse into gear to get this podcast live. I've been planning this podcast probably about six months to a year. It was actually Sarah that said, Right, let's just set a date. Let's make it public. Let's put it out there on social media. Do a countdown. It was that accountability and friendly pressure, I'll say. She wasn't mean, she was just friendly but forceful that got this podcast live. Seriously, as you probably know, if you're listening to this podcast, it has been an absolute life changer for me. I've been able to connect with some amazing people already, and we've had the privilege of meeting some fantastic people, and it's also been great for the business.

Lee:

Sarah has also been advising me as well on the new Social Press launch, which is the Twitter management solution. She's also been advising consistently and trying to keep me accountable for our social media strategy. So what content do we share and how do we engage with people as well? Things I'd never thought of, even simple things like maybe doing video messages to people, etc. I'm absolutely honored to have her. Now, the reason we've invited her, and I am going to shut up and we're going to let Sarah talk in a minute, but the reason I've invited Sarah on is that as design agencies, as web designers, people expect us to know everything there is to know about social media. So let's parallel that with the IT guy. Now, if you've ever been in IT or you've been near the IT Department, essentially people expect the IT guy to be able to fix anything electrical. So that's a computer, obviously. But it could even be the toaster, the sandwich maker, the fridge, or the photocopy. And actually, an IT guy doesn't have any clue about how any of those work. He's an engineer, like a software engineer or a PC hardware specialist.

Lee:

And it's the same with designers. Designers as developers, we don't necessarily know everything there is to know about everything digital. We know how to create great designs. We know how to create great websites. But then there is that expectation that people are going to get SEO or people are going to get social media strategy, expertise, et cetera. I wanted to get Sarah on and really just to give us some amazing pools of wisdom. Like I said, she's really changed our social media strategy over the last few months. We've seen a significant growth in following engagement. I wanted to get her on, get the benefit of her wisdom. I'm sure she's going to drop tons of value bombs because she does whenever we talk. Hopefully, this will be really beneficial to you all and it'd be great if you could also then connect with Sarah, follow her on Twitter, and especially on Periscope, because she's constantly doing amazing periscopes and dropping amazing value all the time. She's constantly giving away free information, so it's nuts. So how's that for an introduction, Sarah? Do you feel any pressure whatsoever?

Sarah Moore:

So much pressure, you have no idea. Thanks for that.

Lee:

Sorry. Epic. So what we're hoping now is that we don't get one word answers. Yes. No.

Sarah Moore:

yeah. I go into freeze mode. I'm like, I don't know. I don't know my job anymore.

Lee:

That would be amazing. Well, I tell you what, let's hear then from you. Could you just give us a bit of background about yourself, how you've got started and your general business as it is at the moment? That would be great to find out a bit more first.

Sarah Moore:

Yeah, sure. So a few years ago, I was made redundant from my corporate job. And in that job, I had become really good friends with the digital manager there. And she gave me little pieces of social media work to do when I was there. That was long before... Actually, it's probably like a year or two, maybe even three years before social media became an actual paid job. And so she gave me bits and pieces to do. And I really enjoyed that. And then I went and had a baby. And I actually, about a year or two after that, I started a business with my mom selling health food online because she's a naturopath and a nutritionist. And I said to her, I'll do the website, I'll do the back end, I'll do the digital, the social, all that stuff because I had a very keen interest in that. I was constantly learning about it. I loved it. So we did that for a while. And then I decided I had the hard chat with her about two years ago, about 18 months ago, and I was like, I need to go and do this as a job for myself.

Sarah Moore:

So we closed that down and I went, I left and started doing my own thing in the broader digital strategy. And then in recent times, have gone social media is my jam. I love it. I understand it. I think my husband is so sick of me talking about it. So I was like, That's probably a good sign that that's what I really, really, really love and want to do. And ever since I made that decision, pretty much every single door that I would hope opens up has opened up. And I have amazing opportunities, like going to speak in San Francisco next week, actually, at the Periscope Summit, the Periscope Community Summit. It's an honour to even be asked. And I'm speaking on live streaming in February and just have all of these. I'm on the WP Innovator podcast.

Lee:

Biggest honour of all.

Sarah Moore:

I've never been on a podcast.

Lee:

Well, biggest honour of all.

Sarah Moore:

So things are exciting. But yeah, that's how I got started. My company now is Eleven Lights Media, and I do social media management and strategy. That's my thing, that's my jam. I think I've answered that question.

Lee:

You have very well. No, that's awesome. It's funny. When I was younger, what I pursued was IT because I thought that paid really well. But I found that I got right up to the very top of being even an IT manager, which was what I was aiming for because I thought that would give me the satisfaction and give me the pay I was expecting, etc. But all that happened was I was in a job that I didn't have a passion about. It wasn't fun. And yet what you're saying here is social media is your jam. Throughout that entire stint as an IT guy, I was pretty much secretly creating programs and creating websites because I loved doing it and I was doing it at night. And it's that Eureka moment for me. I was like, Wait a minute, I really love this. I just need to give up trying to be Mr. Successful IT Guy and go and pursue that thing that I really love. And if I earn less money but I'm happier, then great. But what has happened, because you're pursuing your dream, and it's the same with you, you get that you love it and the energy that you exude, etc.

Lee:

You actually become successful because of that energy and the excitement and the passion that you have for what it is you do. So let me encourage you with that. That's freaking awesome, Sarah. I'm dead excited.

Sarah Moore:

Yeah. And side note to that, just for your listeners as well, if I can speak properly, is that oftentimes we do start broad and we have to... You started in IT, I started in the digital space. And it is about just finding what it is within that general interest that really clicks with you and that you really love. So I just wanted to mention that as well. Exactly. Especially if those people are still figuring those things out.

Lee:

And that's a similar journey to myself. I think Kim Doyal says, If it's not fun, then I'm not going to do it. So that's Kim Doyal, WP chick, and totally agree with that. If it's not fun, it's really not worth doing. So well, over the last 18 months, then, the question we commonly ask people when they're on the podcast is, over the last 18 months, what's been the biggest challenge to your business?

Sarah Moore:

Over the 18 months has been actually figuring out what I love. It's probably taken me longer than 18 months, but I just had such a passion for this digital space, but I just didn't know where I fit in that. And that was really hard because I was trying to wear so many hats similar to you. And it was just... I was just hating the work I was doing. If I can be really honest, I would say yes. And I get paid a lot of money to do some things as well. And I would just be like, I hate this so much. I'd rather get paid less, but I just don't know what it is that I really, really love. So that took me the longest. And it was a bit of an ego thing as well, because I always said I never wanted to be a social media manager. And it was an ego, it was pride. I was like, I don't want to do it. I couldn't think of anything worse than managing other people's, what I called at the time, dirty laundry. This is #realtalk here. And I was like, I could not think of anything worse, made me feel sick in the stomach to even have to do that.

Sarah Moore:

It made me feel chained to a desk. That's what I thought. And that was a genuine feeling. But it was my most requested thing of me. People were like, Can you just do it for me? Can you just do it for me? I was like, No, I want to teach you the strategy. They were like, Please just do it for me. I don't have time. I don't want to do it. I was like, I don't want to do it for you. And then one day, I started secretly doing it. I didn't tell anyone, but I was like, I got asked, so I started doing it. And then I started doing it more. And then I was like, What am I doing? Why isn't this just my job? Because it's actually... It is my job. I'm just not telling anyone that I'm doing it. And then so I started telling people, and that's when things started happening. So there you go.

Lee:

So you were a stealth social media strategist?

Sarah Moore:

I was. And just to be clear, I do not equate what I do with dirty laundry anymore. In fact, I just can't believe how arrogant I was about it, to be honest.

Lee:

What was the catalyst for change then in your view of that? Because obviously you do it for us and I'm like, Oh, dear. I'm torturing you. But then what was the catalyst for change for making you realise it wasn't dirty laundry?

Sarah Moore:

Well, I started doing it and I started loving it. And then side note, September last year, I had emergency surgery, as I think you know, and it forced me to stop for a good month, but probably the initial week, first week or two, I just couldn't think. I just slept a lot. I was just in not actual survival mode, like I wasn't dying or anything, but I was in just looking after myself mode, that thing. And it's funny when you go out of constantly thinking about work and your job and overthinking and all that thing to just having clear moments of clarity. And I remember one night just waking up at 1 AM and just having a download and just going, this is what I want to do. And it's funny because I've been doing it for so long. Like I say, September last year, that's four months ago, but I've been doing it so much longer. But that was my moment of, I'm going to start telling people that that's what I'm doing.

Lee:

That's brilliant. A 1 AM epiphany.

Sarah Moore:

Pretty much.

Lee:

There is something in that, isn't there? I know you were forced to take a break away from the business for a while, but there is something in taking a break and having a week or a few weeks off because over the last couple of weeks, I've Christmas myself. It's just been an incredible time of obviously spending time with a family and that and doing absolutely, in theory, absolutely zero work. But I realized that over the whole time, my brain has just been ticking away and formulating new ideas for the new year. First of January just kicked off with a bang for me. I was just piling out content already, product launches, doing more and more podcast interviews because I realized that these were the things I loved and these were the things I wanted to follow passionately and really started to refocus where I'm going as a business, etc. So time off is immense because when you're just spending time in it, sometimes you just can't see the wood for the trees, can you? No, that's right. And perhaps you don't even appreciate the things that you do do because there's so much stress around you with other things.

Lee:

It can rob you, can't it, of the thing you also love to do because this pressure in other places, especially if our business is broader and they've got lots of plate spinning and they're trying to do all sorts of stuff at once. So let's, Sarah and Lee give you permission today to go and take a break. Do it. But don't send your clients to us or anything because we don't want to take their calls.

Sarah Moore:

It's really hard to do in our society these days. It's really hard to disconnect properly. And so I'm actually so grateful that I was forced to take time out last year because I don't think I would have come to that, because otherwise. And if you think back to what I said, how I said I was being really prideful and arrogant about not wanting to be a social media manager. It actually took being really vulnerable physically. So having that surgery and having to recover actually took that physical thing to bring about an emotional shift and a psychological shift as well. Just realising that I am just human and that what I do actually doesn't define me as well. Getting a little bit philosophical here, sorry, Lee. This is gold.

Lee:

Carry on.

Sarah Moore:

But it's true. That's what it took me. I was vulnerable. I had my husband looking after me and everything, but it was like, You know, life is so short and we don't really have time to be doing things we don't love and we don't really have time to be not doing things we should be doing because we're too arrogant to admit that we should be doing them.

Lee:

Amen. I love it. That is so good. You should have a talk show.

Sarah Moore:

One day.

Lee:

One day. That's where the business will evolve.

Sarah Moore:

That's what I use Periscope for.

Lee:

Yeah, exactly. Well, it's interesting. One of the things we do is we'll put links at the bottom of websites. I think we've all noticed that the amount of icons are growing at the bottom of a website. Not only was it just Facebook and Twitter and LinkedIn, but it's now Instagram, there's now Pinterest, there's now people... Some companies are even putting Snapchat icons on there, et cetera. I didn't warn you about this question, I guess, but as a business, how do I know which social media channel to check? Do I need to be a member of all of them? Because I am definitely not. I pretty much focus just on Twitter and do a little bit of networking on Facebook. I don't even touch LinkedIn, but have you any tips for businesses in finding the right social channels for them?

Sarah Moore:

That's a really good question. It's probably one of the questions I get asked the most. So there's a few ways about it. I don't think there's a perfect answer for it. I think there's a lot of variables, and those variables include your capacity to manage something yourself if you're not going to outsource. So you need to be really realistic about that. You can only manage one because it's overwhelming or because you're really not great at hopping on a social platform and giving it the time that it needs versus sitting on there and scrolling all day, i. E. Facebook. You need to be really honest with yourself about that. Personally, and I know others don't agree with me, so this isn't a universal social media management idea. But I personally think that you are crazy if you're not on Facebook at the moment. Because if you're going to do any paid advertising, Facebook is the lowest cost. There's just no two ways about it. They've got all the data there for you. You can be so specific. It's not like having a billboard. It's not like having a newspaper where a lot of those things, although they have big reach, it's very hit miss.

Sarah Moore:

It's not targeted. Unless you're putting something in a niche magazine, these days it's very hard to target through print media. And people who do print media are going to hate me for saying that. But it's true. I mean, if it's niche, that's great. But that's the beauty of Facebook, because you can literally go in and choose people who earn $85,000 a year and people who live in this suburb, and people who are interested in this golf course and people who follow this particular brand, and people who follow this particular interest. It's so targeted that, in my opinion, it's difficult to do... Okay, it's not difficult to do wrong. You can do ads wrong, but I think it's difficult to make a really, really big mistake when you're experimenting because there's just so many parameters attached. You can set budgets, you can do all these things so that you're not ripping yourself off. You've got time to figure it out and learn it. So that being said, Facebook, you need to be on Facebook purely if you're going to do paid advertising. Then from there, I think it really matters as to the type of business you are.

Sarah Moore:

So if you're B2B, it's a really great idea to be on LinkedIn and learn how to honest LinkedIn. I also think another great B2B place to be is Twitter. Also, if you're looking for any PR ever, Twitter is where you want to be. If you're looking to do things similar to what you're doing, if you're wanting to meet with influencers, if you're wanting to have a podcast show, if you're wanting to have a lab show or something that has video elements to it, Twitter is where you want to be. It's a firehose of noise at times. But if you know what you're doing or you learn how to do these things well, you can connect with amazing people. And generally speaking, most of the time I find it is that person you're not speaking with a representative, or you can at least get to the person you need to. So that's what I absolutely adore about Twitter.

Lee:

That's awesome.

Sarah Moore:

I could go through every platform, but the point is figure out what your capacity for social media is. It is imperative that everybody is on it because people still look at social media and they go, Oh, it's a place for people to chat and blah, blah, blah. But the point is, media and advertising, it's all about where people are. So the reason billboards happened is because somebody went, hang on, there's a million cars on the road every day. Why don't we put up a big sign? It's disruptive. People will see it. Nobody's doing it, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. But now that is a saturated medium. In fact, when was the last time you... What's the last billboard you can remember? When was the last time you were even looking at a billboard when you're in the car? As Gary Vayner Chuck says, his biggest concern is that the drivers who are driving aren't even looking at the road anymore. They're looking at their phone. So this is why social media is so important, because social media is where people are and people are your business. So that's why you have to be there. So again, that being said, just figure out your capacity, be on Facebook, and then from there start to trickle out.

Sarah Moore:

And normally, I caveat that with try and be good at the platform that you're on at the time before you dip your toe in the next social media pond. Because if you are mediocre or even less than mediocre at one, that's going to translate to the next one as well.

Lee:

That is one of the best answers I've ever heard. Thank you. I applaud you. I'll tell you what I got from that. First of all, your capacity. I remember when I first started the new business, I signed up for an account for everything and I did everything badly. First of all, capacity. Another take away I've got is social media is where the people are and people are your business. They're the lifeblood of your business. If you're going to do a social media channel, do it well before moving on to another one. That is so encouraging. I reckon you could probably sell a course just on that question alone because so many people... It is really hard and finding where are the people at. I thought I needed LinkedIn and maybe I do. Maybe we're going to have to take this offline because you highlighted LinkedIn as an important thing. I'm connected to so many people on LinkedIn. I have just no idea who they are. I totally don't use it correctly. I've just discounted it because for me, Twitter has been where my audience tends to be, or people that influence me tend to be on Twitter as well.

Lee:

Usually nine times out of 10, I am actually connecting with that person. I have definitely the bigger guys, I guess. There's definitely a team behind it. But most people I'm connecting with seem to be the actual people because I'll end up actually selling my services those services to them at some point. Or I'm a sucker for a good sales spiel, I might actually be buying their services as well. I was talking to Kim earlier. Kim Doyal and I just mentioned that I think I bought two courses that I haven't done yet because the sales spiel was so good. I was like, I got to buy that. It'll change my life. Now I need to find time to actually do the courses. They are confession. Since we're all being vulnerable here, I'm going to confess that. Maybe everyone should hold me accountable. By the next episode, I'll have done my courses, got my value for money.

Sarah Moore:

Do it. I'll hold you accountable. I'll hold you accountable. You know I will. I know.

Lee:

She spams me.

Sarah Moore:

Can I just say, though, just to add to what you said, so what I was going to say was, even though I'm in social media, and this came to me when you're talking about LinkedIn and how to use it, and when you said the bit about going offline, even though I'm in social media and I'm all about being online, I think I just want to highlight the importance of meeting people in real life and creating a relationship that way. There's no substitute. I mean, social is a good place to start, but there's no substitute for that. And I think that if that's how you have to begin to build up your business, then it's actually probably the best place to start. I'm just going to say that and leave that with you.

Lee:

I feel like I should pause just so that that can sink in. That's awesome. There's nothing like meeting people in real life as well. I've met so many people through social media as well. I've made so many friends, which is awesome. I love the fact that you and me have been able to develop a friendship. And the guys at the entrepreneurs round table that were a member of via Facebook as well. I've made some really good friends there as well that I can actually talk to outside of Facebook and have video chats with just randomly, etc. That's just awesome. Some of those obviously aren't leading to business or anything. It's just having great connections. But on the flip side, I've also had some then that have led to business, not with those guys, but it's about the people that they know as well, which is awesome. .

Sarah Moore:

Yeah.

Lee:

This is great. Value bombs are being dropped. I don't know if John Lee Dumas has patented or copyrighted that phrase, but I've been using it a lot, so I do apologize to him. But everyone knows I fanboy over John Lee Dumas. He's pretty awesome. So if you've not heard of the podcast, it's entrepreneur on fire. Go check that out. There you go. I should be on commission. Well, we've got a question for you then. Normally at this point, it would be about a WordPress plugin, but because we're focusing really on social media for design agencies, how they can improve theirs and or their clients social media strategy, et cetera. What social media application, because I know there's an awful lot of them, like I don't know, Buffer, Hootsuite, and all the other big names, but what social media application would you recommend people go and check out?

Sarah Moore:

Before I do that, I want to talk about this just for 30 seconds because I think it's really important. Go for it. Basically, as a social media manager, one of the things that I do to make life easier for me, and I think it would make life easier for everyone, is I schedule things, which basically means in some ways it's like an automated procedure. I set something, I keep my eye on it, but I don't have to manually do it all the time. In saying that, you need to know the platform that you're on. And I don't recommend a scheduler for everything. So for instance, Facebook, I recommend posting natively in the platform. So that basically means that you can put in a status or a picture or a video, whatever you want, and hit publish in the platform. Don't put in a YouTube link, put in the raw video file if you can. You can schedule within Facebook, and I would recommend that much more highly over using a third party application because Facebook will favour their own Scheduler over that and you'll get a little bit more reach. So in saying that, I'm obviously going to talk about Scheduler.

Sarah Moore:

The one I use is Buffer. I love it. I love the team. Honestly, in this day and age, if a company has a tool that is amazing and then they have the customer service to back that, you've got me for life, basically. And so Buffer, one of the reasons I love them is they have a Scheduler and it lists things out. But as I upgraded with them, they introduced a calendar. And I'm very visual, I'm a very visual person. So to be able to see a calendar at a week's glance was amazing for me. And I'm telling the story because basically there was a lot of glitches when that happened, let's be honest. And I was literally emailing them every single day. I was emailing you every single day at one point as well, Lee, because it was affecting what I was scheduling for you. Things were not going out at all. Other things were going out more than once, that thing. But they were the most amazing support team. They valued what I had to say. And I only say that because if you're looking for a scheduler, their team is incredible. And you can always get them when you ping them on Twitter.

Sarah Moore:

And they're pretty good at their emailing because they've got people all over the world. So generally, there's someone in your time zone takes a bit longer for me because nobody lives down under, but that's all right. So I would suggest Buffer because you can schedule out... Even if you don't pay for it, you can schedule out a day in advance. So even if you gave your scheduling, even if you gave that half an hour a day, that's something that's manageable, even less, because I post a lot. So most people don't post as much as me. Other social media managers do not post as much as me. It's my strategy, it's not anybody else's, and that's fine. So you could give it five minutes, really. If you only want to post X amount of times, just you can give your schedule of five minutes. But I post a lot. So it really helps me to be able to do that in bulk. There's also analytics and things like that attached to it as well. So that can be really helpful when trying to see if people are clicking on content and what's happening with that and if it's working or not.

Lee:

That's awesome. So that's Buffer. We'll put that in the show notes. I think it's... Is it Bufferapp.com or have they managed to buy buffer.com now?

Sarah Moore:

They've got... I think it is buffer.com. Let me just...

Lee:

Back in there when I were a lad, it was buffer app.

Sarah Moore:

Oh, yeah. No, it's buffer.com. Yeah, look at that. Awesome. Yeah. Sorry. Continue. I wasn't going to say anything.

Lee:

No worries. Okay, so that's Buffer. Now, personally used Buffer for our other business, which you all know, I also have shares in a design agency and we have used buffer for many years to manage the posting of social media there. Now, a good question for you, Sarah, I think here is the whole concept of set and forget. And it might seem funny me saying this, but I am launching a new product just for Twitter in WordPress that will automate the procedure of sharing and re sharing your WordPress content and maybe some RSS feeds, et cetera, which is great to automate that thing, and it's very helpful. But why shouldn't people think that if they just load a whole lot of stuff in a scheduler that they can set and forget? Maybe what are the pitfalls or what would you encourage people to do? I'm guessing maybe things around engagement, et cetera, rather than just shouting at people. But I'll shut up. But yeah, could you expand on why Set and Forget is probably a bad idea?

Sarah Moore:

Yeah. So highly controversial topic. So well done, Lee, for picking that.

Lee:

Especially because it's the line of my social media plug in the world's first set and forget. But it's the only way I can get people's attention. But then I want you to educate them. Anyway, I'll shut up. Carry on.

Sarah Moore:

Yeah. So it's not... Okay, automation is not a bad thing. I've had many discussions around this. There's just a few tricks to it. So setting and forgetting is not the world's worst crime by any stretch of the imagination. But the thing that you've got to take into account when you automate anything is that you do have to continually check on it. You do have to make sure that you're not keeping a burst of the world events and things like that. So for example, when all the Paris stuff happened a few months ago, I think I emailed you then, Lee, didn't I? And I said, should we stop for a day? Stop the automation process for a day. And I think we did. We did. I think we did. I think we did, from memory. Just because you just want to honour what's going on in the world and show people that you are human, that it's not all about here's my stuff. Sometimes it's about the bigger picture. So that's one thing I would suggest if you're going to automate anything, just keep a top of tragedy in particular. The other thing is that, again, automation is not bad.

Sarah Moore:

But what is bad is when people automate and then they never go and check that platform. So I really cannot stand people who automate and have massive followings, but they never go and engage, or they engage once a fortnight or once a month. It's not good enough. If you're pushing out content, you need to be there to field questions, to interact with the people who are taking time out of their day to engage with your content. And you need to be taking that time to build those relationships and respect those people that are consuming what you're putting out. So that's probably one of the biggest things from my perspective. And the other thing I will add to this, and I actually think this is almost more important than anything, right? So one of the things when we automate and we set and forget, if you like, is if it's all your own content, it's fine because you know what you're putting out. You know that you're representing yourself. There's nothing in there that will offend others, or maybe there is, but you know what's in there, so that's okay. If you're putting out other people's content and you're not curating it by reading it first, you're just going, I trust this source, then you really need to have wholehearted trust in that source.

Sarah Moore:

I have a handful of blogs and people in particular that I know and trust, and I will go, That looks amazing. I'm going to put that in my feed, and I won't necessarily have read it. This is the first time I'm admitting this because I used to read every piece of content I put out. I would not post anything, and you know how much I post, Lee? I would not post anything unless I had read it in full. But I've since learned that given how much content I put out, that's not always achievable. So I have a few trusted resources where I don't read every single word that they put out. In saying that, you need to be well aware that if they do put something out and you haven't proofread it first, you need to just always be ready to accept any consequence from that. It's a bit different from people who have RSS feeds who it just goes out. They don't even look at it. They just go, Yep, I go through and I handpick every piece of content for my clients and for myself. So even though I have people I trust, if I see a heading, then I'm like, That's a bit funny, or it sounds too good to be true, or whatever.

Sarah Moore:

I'm not going to mention any names. There's a particular really, really, really big social media brand, and I will not put a piece of content out from them that I do not read first because it's not always quality. And it really bugs me because they're a leading source in it. So from my perspective, you really need to be confident in the content that you're putting out if you're going to automate it at any point.

Lee:

That's fine. It reminds me very early on when you said, Give me a list of your absolute trusted resources as well. I gave you a list of people like Troy Dean, Kim Doyal, Bob WP, etc. So all people in the WordPress space that are massive influence of me. And then, of course, people like John Lee Dumas, etc. Also, potentially, I don't know if I've mentioned this on the podcast before, but faith is very important to me. And you were explaining as well the importance of letting people know who I am as well. I even gave you a few Christian influencers, like the guys from Hillsong accounts, et cetera. T here's a local guy in the UK who's a Christian, but he's a businessman entrepreneur, and he puts out amazing content as well. But these were all sources that I absolutely trusted before I gave you them. And I think we even reviewed and I think I even removed one eventually as well because I realized it wasn't quite the right target, et cetera. So important. But yeah, I wanted to put that out there because I'm putting a product out there that will essentially allow people to do that.

Lee:

But really what I want to do is make it convenient for people to share, especially their own content and certain types of content, make it more cost effective as well because they could manage multiple Twitter accounts. So it's probably more like an agency thing where they could manage multiple Twitter accounts, et cetera. But also just highlight the fact that automation, yes, is great, but there is nothing better than engaging with people and obviously checking what's going out there. Because I remember when I automated a few years ago, when I checked my feed, it was sending out things like adverts to things that were just totally not what anyone who was following me would be into because obviously it was a generic source. Very valuable information. Thank you very much. You've noticed I'm probably asking questions I want to know the answer to, but I know everyone else does, which is great. I know my audience.

Sarah Moore:

All good.

Lee:

That's awesome. Well, I know everybody wants to learn more about social media. The agencies listening, the guys listening want to be able to maybe provide more resources for their clients, et cetera. You've just admitted to being a avid content reader, although you've managed to free up a bit of time and not read absolutely everything. But are there any sources for you as a social media expert that you would encourage people to go ahead and check out where they can learn more about social media and be immersed in everything that's going on there?

Sarah Moore:

Yes. This is not anything new. But I would go and read the Buffer blog. They have a few different areas in their blog, but they have a social media part. And the reason why I love that is because their focus is basically just being as helpful as possible. So instead of going, Here's one tip to tweet. It's like, Here is every single thing we wish we knew about Twitter before we were on. And then they've been on for five years. So it's like a comprehensive list. They're a really quality source for social content. And you'll get lost for days in there. They're so helpful. At the moment, if you go to their... It's blog.bufferapp.com. And if you go to the social media page there now because they have a few. They've got Social Open Overflow and Happiness. They're all blog titles. But the social one, like the first one is 50 plus free high quality social media icon sets. How helpful is that for you guys as WordPress developers and design agencies? So that's just the thing that they do, and I love them. They are my explicitly one trusted source that always have everything I love.

Sarah Moore:

Aside from that, there's always social media examiner. And I also highly recommend for anything visual related, sociallysorted.com.au with Donna Moritz. Let me just double check. She does visual content. She's had her blog voted best blog couple of years running, something like that. I'm sorry, I'm not doing her justice right now. But she's amazing. She's another Oze. She's constantly speaking at social media marketing events. She flies up to the US and does social media marketing world. So she's an amazing resource as well. And I think that they're probably... I mean, Buffer and Donna's blog are good places to start, in my opinion. They're probably some of my most trusted.

Lee:

Well, I'll make sure that those are also in the show notes, and I'm going to go ahead and check those out as well. I have read a few things on the Buffer app log before, and again, they do post great things, especially for designers as well, is the icon sets and different things they share. They don't just do icons. They shared a whole lot of stock images a few months ago as well, and I downloaded. I think there was something like 1,000 high quality stock images, which are still there if you go ahead and search the Buffer blog, and they're great, especially when we're using big hero spaces on a website and you want a really nice background. They were professional pictures. They weren't something that you'd find off maybe... You can go and find some open source images that look like they've been taken with a fairly good camera. These were proper shutter stock, as it were, quality images. They were pretty amazing. So yeah, definitely recommend that myself. And that's awesome. Well, I guess what we'll do then is we've had so much of your time. It's been amazing. Thank you so much for spending the time with us and teaching us so much.

Lee:

I guess we'll wrap up the podcast with some advice from you, something that people could start to action today that you know will make a big difference either to their business or to their social media strategy. Then we'll wrap up the podcast. Over to you.

Sarah Moore:

Well, thank you for having me. I just want to say that first of all. But my last piece of actionable advice is it goes back to the start. We've come full circle. It's about figuring out what is doable for you and then being consistent in that. So if you're creating content or putting content out, figure out what is doable for you and be consistent. So if it's once a week, do that. If it's once a month, do that. But try not to be erratic with it. Just try and be really consistent. And I mean, with that consistency comes things like getting organized and figuring out a content calendar, that thing. We obviously don't have time for that. But if you think I'm going to create content once a week, then sit down, try and write out the next 10 things you're going to talk about, because that will help you stay on task. That will help you actually put out that content. One thing we haven't really talked a lot about is content marketing, but that putting out content is the key for people to find you. It's the key for people to connect with you.

Sarah Moore:

It's key for people to think that you're an expert in your space. It's the key for people to know what you do and understand what you do.

Lee:

So consistency. I think if you're interested, we would love to have you back in a few weeks time, to be honest, if you would like to talk more about content marketing. We have to keep these to 30 to 40 minutes because people are driving to work. So there's a lot of people doing commutes, et cetera, who are listening to the podcast. But I really feel like we've only scratched the tip of the iceberg on the amazing stuff you want to share that you have to share, sorry. But I tell you what, what would be awesome is every single possible way that you would like the audience to connect with you so that people can engage with you, follow your amazing content, and learn more from you. So where would the best places be to go?

Sarah Moore:

Well, as you know, Lee, I've just opened up my new brand, which is Eleven Lights Media. So you can find me at elevenlightsmedia.com.au, and I'm just starting to create the content for that now. When I go to San Fran, I'll be creating a lot of that content there as well. You can also find me there @elevenlights. Actually, it's just @elevenlights on Twitter as well.

Lee:

Is that the number 11 or is that text?

Sarah Moore:

It's the word. Cool. It's the word. Always looks cool. Bad choice. I should have done. No, I'm happy with it.

Lee:

elevenlights, isn't it?

Sarah Moore:

Yeah, Elevenlights. But I think we'll also put probably in the show notes just my personal brand at the moment, because that's where I am. I'm still pushing out all of the other social at the moment. So you can find me at the_sarah_moore. At most places, Twitter, on Facebook, I'm @thesarahmooreperiscope is the same as my Twitter, etc. We can put all that in the show notes. I'm on Instagram, I'm everywhere. It's my job.

Lee:

Exactly. And you are the Sarah Moore. And I am totally honoured and grateful that you took the time out. You've just been amazing. Thank you so much, Sarah. Thanks, Lee. I hope we can have you back soon because...

Sarah Moore:

You can.

Lee:

Content marketing.

Sarah Moore:

Yes. When I'm back from San Fran.

Lee:

Would be epic. And absolutely wish you all the very best in San Fran, I can't wait to hear how that goes. Thank you. All righty, take care. Cheers. Thanks. Bye. And there you have it. What a fantastic interview with Sarah Moore. Now, I'd really love your feedback. I'd like to know if you think the sound quality is okay. I've made quite a lot of adjustments. I'd also like to know if there is anyone you'd like to hear from on the podcast or whether you'd like to be on the podcast yourself. The place to get me on is leejacksondev.com/podcast or give me a shout on Twitter. It's @leejacksondev. Thank you so much for taking the time to listen to the podcast. I really appreciate all the feedback that people are sending in, so please do get in touch. It really does help and it's really, really encouraging. Lastly, if I can encourage you to check out SociPress on lejacksondev.com/plug in. It'd be great for you to check that out and give, again, any feedback you have on the new plugin that we've launched. All right, guys, have an epic day and keep innovating.